Fangame: The Game

[Valkama]

Sorry I meant auto scrolling in platformers and birds eye view games.

Edit: ok got to the new version of the room. And the room still sucks. I think the thing you aren't getting is that room needs a complete overhall. Your Idea behind the room just doesn't work if you want to make your game fun. The level design is fragmented and bad. It still doesn't look nice. And it is not fun to play.

[vertigoelectric]

Edit: ok got to the new version of the room. And the room still sucks. I think the thing you aren't getting is that room needs a complete overhall. Your Idea behind the room just doesn't work if you want to make your game fun. The level design is fragmented and bad. It still doesn't look nice. And it is not fun to play.

I typed out a rather lengthy response, but then I realized I'd prefer to just not deal with you so I erased it.  My mistake for wasting my time typing it.

I will say this, though.  Stop playing Fangame.  You've made it very clear time and time again that you don't enjoy it.  I'm not changing it for you.  I have no reason to.  I don't care if you play it or not.  There are plenty of people who like it the way it is.  I don't need you or your condescending comments about my game taking up space in this thread.

Go play something else.  Stop bothering me.

[Valkama]

Well I will tell you this. Your fangame and pickory are the only 2 fangames on this board that have shown potential. I have been trying to help you improve your game. Your game has potential but its not there yet and that is what I have been trying to help you with.

I am harsh but that is what I have been trying to do. You are different from other people and that being harsh doesn't work with you, and rather you go into a defensive stage. So now I am being nice. Your game does have great rooms. Your game also has aweful rooms.

Now plz tell me who likes the room that I have been complaining about because I want to know why they like it.

[vertigoelectric]

Well that's probably the most positive thing I've ever heard you say... or read you write... or whatever.

Yes, you are harsh.  Too harsh.  Any implication that you were genuinely trying to help was completely lost in the arrogant manner of your condescending remarks.  It's much better to at least try to be nice.  I don't respond well to insults.  I'm willing to work with you on your suggestions if you can manage to be friendly about them like most people.

As far as the room you are talking about, it's not going to change.  At least, not now.  At this time I have no intentions of changing that room or any other rooms already built into the game.  I am far more concerned about finishing the game.  I already know that a lot of the design is bad.  It is my first game and the fact that it's not a complete failure altogether is a miracle in itself.  However, rather than go back and try to fix all of the things in the game that "could be better", I'd rather spend my time on completing the rest of the game.

Of course, if bugs or actual gameplay problems are found, I will need to fix those.  Like that bug you found with Cloud 9.1 involving going beyond the right edge of the screen.  That was a big deal, and I am grateful you pointed it out.  I fixed it.

Part of what I had said that I deleted was that some of the rooms were designed almost entirely to challenge the player's patience and frustration threshold.  They aren't meant to be necessarily "fun" or "entertaining".  Some are meant to be deliberately deceptive and confusing.  While I try to implement these types of rooms sparingly, they still are part of the game.

I suppose one way you could look at the Fangame project is to consider it all a big experiment to see what I can do or get away with so I'll have more filtered ideas for my next game.  You think a room is awful?  Okay, I'll keep that in mind when I make my next game.  I don't want to go back and rearrange this one.



I will say I'm a bit surprised to find that you think that Fangame is one out of only two games on this forum that show potential.  I guess that really means something coming from someone who seems to hate everything.

[Valkama]

Alright well then here is something I would like to suggest for your next area.

Be original and creative with each room. Make every room stand out. I can't count how many times I've seen a room with effing invisible blocks. You say its an experiment. Well if thats the case then why are there rooms with the same gimick. If this game is an experiment then you should try something new in every room. This also prevents the player from getting bored because the player will soon realize that the reason he wants to complete each room is because he wants to see what gimick is going to be in the next room and what new trap is going to kill them. This why I dislike alot of fangames because they don't give me a reason to finish the rooms.

Also if you ever make an adventure game again. Don't use portals. It shows signs of laziness. Making areas flow into other areas looks alot nicer than just one second your in one place the next your in another.

Also to explain why I am harsh. I come from a forum where the only way to get someone to change there game is to be highly negative about something.

[vertigoelectric]

Be original and creative with each room. Make every room stand out.

Not every room can be a brand new idea.  Sure you can use new and creative ideas throughout the game, but to expect every room to be unique and original and captivating is simply asking too much.

Think about Metroid, which many will agree is a very much loved classic.  A lot of the space in that game is taken up by long hallways and corridors in which very little happens.  There might be enemies scattered throughout, but a lot of it is just tedious travel. A long corridor in one area may be just like a long corridor in another area (gameplay-wise) with only a change in tileset and enemy sprites.  There really isn't anything too creative or original about them that make them stand out.  There isn't really anything difficult or challenging about them.  They're just a way to get from one place to another.

Similarly, some rooms in Fangame are just there to connect the other rooms together.  There are some rooms that really make you think or present engaging challenges, and in between them are other rooms that don't really have anything to solve and are just a way to get from the last room to the next.  These rooms could be equated somewhat to those long and sometimes boring corridors and hallways in Metroid that just go to and from the more interesting places.  However, being Fangame is an IWBTG-inspired game that caters to players with a thirst for brutality, rather than make rooms that you just walk through easily, I fill them with ridiculous jump'n'dodge obstacles.  Part of the drive to get through them is to see the next interesting area.

Yes, some of the rooms use stuff like invisible blocks, and there are parts that are indeed "gimmicky".  That's not a problem.  It only becomes a problem when the game fully relies on the gimmicks to become entertaining.  I'm sure just about everything in Fangame could be somehow tied to some sort of gimmick, but I think anybody who has played it can tell that I have definitely taken the initiative to try to do something different overall.  Starting without the gun, for example, is something not often seen in the IWBTG fangame community.  Most of the graphics are a little more polished and have more depth.  The main character is 100% original.  Etcetera, etcetera...

Also if you ever make an adventure game again. Don't use portals. It shows signs of laziness. Making areas flow into other areas looks alot nicer than just one second your in one place the next your in another.

Most people just accept the way games are made and just use their imagination.  With you, I feel like I have to explain everything.

The teleporters in Fangame were the result of poor planning.  No, the result of a complete lack of planning.  I originally had a door that led to a darkened cave area.  I'm honestly not sure how it turned into teleporters.  Perhaps if you watch my "History of fangame" or whatever I called it on YouTube, it'll explain why I started to use teleporters.  Maybe I didn't mention it.  I don't remember.  I should watch it again.  Anyway, it was the best I could do at the time I implemented it.  It made the most sense then.

FYI:  There are already a lot of things about Fangame that I would not do in future games.

[Valkama]

Original and creative can be taken the wrong way. I mostly wanted you to read the "Make every room stand out." since that is what you want to do. You want to give the player something to look forward to when they finish a room. (BTW do you know how many people complain about the same room again and again in metroid) However the key player is the death count. You want to kill the player just enough so that they don't quit but they don't get bored. I know this is an experiment so that might be one thing your experimenting.

Although you like to put those dick move traps at the end of rooms sometimes. If you do that in a segment that is too hard you can cause the player to quit because the one thing you have to remember is that in a trap based game you want to kill the player but you don't want to kill the player too much. So those dick moves at the end. Use them sparingly. That twomp however normally I would get mad that traps get old again and again and again. But I feel the twomp is a like master claw in iwbtg where basically if they are not abused they don't get old. The twomp gives the player a fear of the ceiling. They don't know if a thwomp will come down or not.

And as for my point with the portals. Its not like you have to do it. I am just saying that you can show off alot if you have good transition rooms. Like maybe when going to a desert there are like maybe rooms where the grass slowly turns brown and then is all gone and finally is just sand.

Like I have said before you are doing good but the game isn't there yet. I hope you go back and fix the rooms after your done with the game. But if you don't want to that is fine. I really want to say more but now I am forgetting what I have already said.

[dcx666]

Anyway... It's almost been a month...How is it going?

[vertigoelectric]

Anyway... It's almost been a month...How is it going?

Has it been that long since my last release?  Well, I've been doing a little work on the game.  I haven't ignored it.  I just haven't changed enough to release anything... well maybe I have.

I'll release something soon.  I'm about get starting on designing a new level.  Either that, or I'll focus on finishing the Amper Sands boss.  We'll see.

[dcx666]

Well if needs be I can wait a month if you like...

Also Im having a go at mmf2 but have no idea where to start.. (*__________*")

[vertigoelectric]

Well if needs be I can wait a month if you like...

Also Im having a go at mmf2 but have no idea where to start.. (*__________*")

Wait a month for what?

Hmmmm... I might be able to help you with MMF2 a little bit.  However, I'd recommend you download the Gwerdy chat client from the Clickteam forums because there are usually people in that chat that can help you with.

[dcx666]

Well work deadline, going to Germany and doing "family" business so yeah another months wait.

And beside you said you havent done much anyway...right?

[vertigoelectric]

Well work deadline, going to Germany and doing "family" business so yeah another months wait.

And beside you said you havent done much anyway...right?

Well, I've done some stuff.  Just haven't released anything yet.

Still, I'm really not sure what you meant by "I can wait a month if you like..."  I'm not sure what you're saying you can wait a month for, and what it has to do with me.

[Ramon]

I agree with Anonymous on certain aspects - mainly the parts that gimmicks shouldn't be overused and new creative stuff should appear along the way - but I think Fangame is very balanced in terms of this matter.
Also, I actually like the idea with the transition rooms a lot. Yes, it would require a few changes, but in overall I need to say it'd be pretty awesome. IWBTG's transitions between two areas is pretty blunt

[Luis]

Just a quick question: Have you discontinued this? I was pretty interested in Fangame for awhile. It had some potential.